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Post by littlepe on Mar 11, 2022 4:42:47 GMT
Hi and thanks for this superb route.
I have been creating a scenario that involves entry into Lille Bridge Depot from West Kensington 1,
The signal on the end of the platform - WC2 - is red and stays that way, despite the previous signal showing 2 greens.
There is no shunt signal there so the only course of action is to pass the red - which it lets you do. All the other signals to get into the depot work fine.
As a test i created a scenario just from Earls Court to Barons Court - WC2 also stayed red.
I would like to say that i have paid a fair bit of money for other underground routes and this route far surpasses them.
I seem to have a fascination for the underground routes because i was a guard/motorman on the Met line out of Neasden in the early 70's. You would think that sometimes working the circle line - 4 circuits before break and 3 after would have put me off LU for ever - but no.
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Post by Jimi on Mar 11, 2022 13:43:19 GMT
Hi, and a pleasure to meet a LUL Motorman! We will greatly appreciate any comments and suggestions you may have. We have scenarios that use the WKN1 entry into Lillie (pull ahead to LOS, then reverse wrong-road via Shunt WC31 into WKN2), and that works fine; so we're not aware of any issues with WC2. I just checked all the signal links in the editor and all are correct (WC2/WC9 (WKN2 wrong road starter), WC31/WC32). The only way WC 2 should remain red is if 12 points (WKN x-over) are set reverse. That said, I'll try repeating your tests and see what happens. Gimme a couple of hours to investigate... Note, it is *possible* that entry from WK2 may act funny. WB34 (main) should be red with WB31 (shunt disc) Off. On occasions the shunt doesn't clear due to a glitch in the JT shunt disc signal.
Ah ha! I just re-read your note in detail again and may have the solution. You say the previous signal (WKN1 home) is green/green so the path for WC2 *must* be clear. That means an issue with TS incorrectly initializing WC2. That failure to correctly INIT all signals will happen if you edit a scenario and then run it from the editor. You must exit out of edit via clicking the arrow icon, then QUIT and *then* Restart the scenario. That will ensure all signals INIT correctly. Please let us know if that fixes it - I bet it does.
For benefit of all our readers who may not have known about this TS Scenario Edit glitch, a clue this has happened is that typically signals that are semi-autos that read across junctions may be incorrectly INITed and display the wrong aspect. Autos usually init fine as their default state is clear. Semi default state is red until a train approaches, at which time the required state is determined - usually about 3 signals ahead of the train.
So whenever you edit a scenario, Save, then exit out and then QUIT and Restart the scenario.
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Post by littlepe on Mar 12, 2022 5:16:50 GMT
Many thanks Jimi - dead right. whenever i launch the scenario from the editor - WC2 stays red. Launch from 'Drive' and all is good.
If you are designing a long scenario with many instructions - is there a way to test drive say halfway down the instructions list - not from the beginning. The only way i have been able to do is to make up a second scenario starting from lower down the instructions list.
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Post by Jimi on Mar 12, 2022 13:26:25 GMT
Good to hear! BTW, you don't need to exit all the way back to Main menu and then Drive. After exiting the editor (via Clicking the run arrow) the scenario will load and run. Once in the cab, hit ESC and then click RESTART. That will force a full scenario load/Init.
Re starting a scenario part way down the list - what a great idea, but no way I know of doing it. I remember debugging some of our longer scenarios only needing to check the last 10 minutes! I suspect it's hard to implement, although the TS "dispatcher" (line controller?) evaluates every train's path and possible interactions with other trains and signals as you create/edit the scenario. Sometimes with a lot of trains adding a single task to a train will take many seconds as the impact is evaluated. So TS *is* figuring out what will likely happen in the future.
One way you could try is to use the VCR capability to play the scenario (at increased speed) to the point you're interested in and then stop. I believe the files are then in a state representing that point in time. However, you meed a full back up of the scenario folder contents to recover the state back to "as designed".
In addition, the VCR will play all trains exactly as though they are all AI (including player train), so you lose the variability of how a player might drive their train and interactions with AI trains and the schedule.
In short - I don't think there's a safe or easy way. But I'll give it some thought...
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Post by littlepe on Mar 16, 2022 10:16:42 GMT
Hi Jimi. Been concocting around Lillie and noticed a couple of thing that i thought you might like to know about.
I cannot get WB27 to clear no matter what i do. WB1A and LIL4E clear before and after - but not 27. It is not because i launch from the editor - you kindly have stopped me making that error.
Also there is a signal marked on all the maps as OLY just out of Olympia- but i cannot find it.
Regards.
Please dont think this is a complaint - by no means - really enjoying the route.
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Post by Jimi on Mar 16, 2022 15:59:20 GMT
Hi! I'm aware of WB27 and have tried to fix it a number of times. There's very dense pointwork and a very small gap to fit a number of signal links in that area and I've yet to find a spot that works. As you note the preceding and following are fine. I may just remove WB27 as the cleared path can be successfully shown without it. There's a similar issue on exit for one of the possible paths (WKN, Whitely's siding, Oly). You're very observant re the "OLY" signal on the chart - no one else has spotted that:-) As I'm sure you know, Olympia does not have a starter signal, therefore when a train departs towards ECT or Lillie there's nothing (visible) to trigger the following signals (WB7 with RI/WB28) that a train is approaching. IRL the track circuit (BY/3) becoming occupied would do so, but in TS we need actual signals to define the track section boundaries. So there is a physical auto signal named "OLY" buried underground part way down the track. A train passing it will turn it to red (track section occupied) and also send a message to the signal in advance (WB7) that there's a train approaching. As this next signal is a semi-auto with RI, default showing red, we need to trigger it to evaluate the path state and display the appropriate aspect. It will either show straight green (towards ECT) or RI lit if path set onto the wrong-road section towards Lillie reception road. The following shunt signal (WB28) gives access onto the reception road.
And please, feel free to comment on or ask about anything! Always enjoy discussing LUL stuff, especially technical details. There are a number of former and current Motormen and I/Ops on the board whose knowledge and experience and comments keeps us honest; and we're delighted to have you in that list.
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Post by littlepe on Mar 18, 2022 4:06:11 GMT
Thanks Jimi. WB27 is no problem - for my scenario i can hide it behind a sign. Out of curiosity i dove underground to find OLY and there it was shining away all on its lonesome :-)
I was marveling how close the exhibition hall was to the depot - only to find out it has now gone! in pursuit of greater wealth i guess - Aly Paly look out!
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